Registration needed for both lists?

[kvivian]

Ron/Mark,

I thought I was clear on everything from your emails, but now I'm confused.  There is apparently a "discussion list" (which is the "old" act-KM list and archive) and this "new" list.  I was asked to register for both independently (and since I wasn't sure which you had already pre-registered me for, I did). 

Why are there two groups, and which is the one we should use actively for discussions like we had previously on Yahoo?

Thanks!
Kaye Vivian

[RonRogers]

Kaye,
sorry for the confusion, I will try an explain and clear the waters a bit for you  .

The previous discussion list on Yahoo (also known as a listserv/mailinglist) was deleted, Mark has managed to obtain copies of most of the messages and they will be made available as an archive soon.

The facility that was being provided by Yahoo where the membership could send an email to a specified address which would be broadcast to all other members has been replaced by the new Discussion List you can also access this from the link in the navigation on the main part of the actkm.org website. Mark was able to provide me with a list of contact email addresses pulled from the list prior to it being deleted but this list was out of date. An Invite was sent to each of those email addresses inviting them to sign up to the new list, due to spamming regulations all lists must be double opt-in ie. You must register yourself and then confirm the registration before being subscribed, hence the Invite rather than just being Subscribed. (Signup No. 1)

The new Mailman Discussion List works much like the list on Yahoo, you have the option of receiving emails one by one or in a daily digest. There is also the Archive system so you can view previous messages and if required you can download them from the Archive in monthly digests.

The feature that you are currently using is something new for actkm.org and is commonly referred to as a Bulletin Board or Forum, I suggested it to Mark as part of the updated features of the new website. It is another way of having a discussion and sharing information to participate you need to register again double opt-in as you have to confirm your regsitration.(Signup No. 2)

Why not make things so only 1 signup?
The two systems are provided by different suppliers (both open source) and use a different method for storing registration data, modifications would have been extensive and costly.

Why have the Bulletin Board in addition to the Discussion List?
The discussion list replaces what you had on Yahoo and most of you will be very comfortable with that, if you prefer you only need to register for the discussion list as it will continue to run as is.
The Bulletin Board is provided for those discussions that may not be of particular interest to the entire group or for topics that may be raised that a certain group may want to discuss separately. Participation is optional and you can subscribe to a topic currently under discussion to be notified when someone else replys.

If you wish to start a new Topic (like you have done here) and want to get others to join in then take note of the Subject and send a message to the rest of the group using the discussion group to let them know.

When it comes to group discussions both systems are used, some people prefer Discussion Lists and some prefer Bulletin Boards, I'm in the latter group but then again I spend alot of time online. Which you use is up to you but both have been provided.

Hope this explains some of the reasons behind the changes and clears it up a bit for you.

[mod update - changed "Forum" to "Bulletin Board" to clear up the confusion around the name]

[kvivian]

Thanks, Ron.  Very helpful indeed.

I'm still fuzzy though...Maybe you could just give a brief reply to these questions (I'm not sure everyone uses the terms forums, lists and discussions to mean the same things)...

1.  Is the only way to learn of new discussions in the Bulletin Board (here) to log in and read the Bulletin Boards?  (I understand that I can ask for emails of replies to a topic I choose to follow, but how will I learn there is a brand new topic without logging in?)

2.  Will the exchanges we  had in the old group continue solely in the "Discussions" group, i.e. via email?

3.   Will the topics from the Discussion group also be logged in the Bulletin Board, so if you come to read the Bulletin Board you will see *everything*?

4.  If not, what criteria are used to determine when a topic should be "moved" from the mailing list Discussion group to the "Bulletin Board" as a "side conversation"?  How will people be able to receive subsequent messages on a thread that gets moved to the Bulletin Board...will they have to log in and manually ask to receive subsequent postings? (this sounds like a recipe for disaster, if it's true)

5.  Will a digest furnished by the Bulletin Boards include only Bulletin Board messages/threads or will it include the "Discussion" group messages as well? (Will we still get a Discussion group digest?)

6.  If we reply to an e-mail to respond to a topic, will our reply automatically be entered into the Discussions or Bulletin Board lists or both?

7.  Is is really necessary to have two places for one group?  I think you risk losing readers/participants in the confusion (or maybe I'm the only one who is thinking there are two separate places to participate and they are not integrated).


I'm still finding it confusing to know how to be sure that I remain plugged in to the actKM group.  My personal preference would be to have:

*   A single source for all messages/discussions. You can pick what to call it, but I will participate by email, and if you rely on me to log in on a web site somewhere be active, the reality is I won't remember to, despite good intentions! Sad

*   Digest that will encompass all topics discussed by actKM members in both places in one digest

*   The ability to reply to an e-mail (or create an email using a topic heading) and have it go out to the group, as well as be logged in the Bulletin Board or whatever place messages normally get catalogued and accessed.


As an example, I have posted this message in the Bulletin Board.  Did the "Discussion" group people get it e-mailed to them, or will they only see it by logging in to the Bulletin Board?

Sorry to be so obtuse... :)

Kaye

[Mod - update changed"Forum" to "Bulletin Board" to clear up some of the confusion around the naming]

[RonRogers]

I'll answer your questions in turn

1.  Is the only way to learn of new discussions in the Forums (here) to log in and read theBulletin Board?  (I understand that I can ask for emails of replies to a topic I choose to follow, but how will I learn there is a brand new topic without logging in?)

Once you have registered and logged in a cookie will be set so to see if there is anything new you just need to visit theBulletin Board. If you wish to be Notified of any new Topics click on the Board name "General KM Discussion" and you will be presented with a list of the current topics, click on the "notify" button and you will be asked to confirm that you wish to be notified of any new topics. When someone starts one you will get an email.

2.  Will the exchanges we  had in the old group continue solely in the "Discussions" group, i.e. via email?

As far as I know Yes that will continue as before.

3.   Will the topics from the Discussion group also be logged in the Bulletin Board, so if you come to read the Bulletin Board you will see *everything*?

No, this Bulletin Board is a separate feature, the Discussion list will remain the primary form of communication.

4.  If not, what criteria are used to determine when a topic should be "moved" from the mailing list Discussion group to the "Bulletin Board" as a "side conversation"?  How will people be able to receive subsequent messages on a thread that gets moved to the Bulletin Board...will they have to log in and manually ask to receive subsequent postings? (this sounds like a recipe for disaster, if it's true)

That's one for you the Moderators to determine. Most likely if a discussion is between two or more people and may not be suitable for a widspread brodcast to all members then it will be suggested it be moved to the Bulletin Board with a notice to everyone on the Discussion list of that fact. A very lively discussion can become very disjointed as people start quoting one another and responding at different times.

5.  Will a digest furnished by the Bulletin Board include only Bulletin Board messages/threads or will it include the "Discussion" group messages as well? (Will we still get a Discussion group digest?)

No if you notices from the Bulletin Board they will only be from the Bulletin Board, the Discussion list is separate.

6.  If we reply to an e-mail to respond to a topic, will our reply automatically be entered into the Discussions or Bulletin Board lists or both?

To reply on the Bulletin Board you must come and visit and type in your responce.
Again the Discussion list is separate.

7.  Is is really necessary to have two places for one group?  I think you risk losing readers/participants in the confusion (or maybe I'm the only one who is thinking there are two separate places to participate and they are not integrated).

Maybe that's one you you all to discuss?
The two are different ways of working, personally I like the Bulletin Board and have used them for years. Using a Bulletin Board requires much more time online where using a mailing list as you all currently do it can be read offline.

I'm still finding it confusing to know how to be sure that I remain plugged in to the actKM group.  My personal preference would be to have:

*   A single source for all messages/discussions. You can pick what to call it, but I will participate by email, and if you rely on me to log in on a web site somewhere be active, the reality is I won't remember to, despite good intentions! Sad

*   Digest that will encompass all topics discussed by actKM members in both places in one digest

*   The ability to reply to an e-mail (or create an email using a topic heading) and have it go out to the group, as well as be logged in the Bulletin Board or whatever place messages normally get catalogued and accessed.

That's fine and as things stand at the moment that's the way things are, you will all be using the Discussion list and send emails to actkm@actkm.org which will then go out to everyone who has subscribed. This is no different to what you have been used to with the Yahoo group.

As an example, I have posted this message in the Bulletin Board.  Did the "Discussion" group people get it e-mailed to them, or will they only see it by logging in to the Bulletin Board?

The only people who know about this are those who have visisted the Bulletin Board, you do not have to register to read the Bulletin Board but you must register to post. That said you have raised some interesting questions and I wil send an email to the Discussion group to let everyone else know what we have been talking about.

Sorry to be so obtuse...

Not a problem, Bulletin Board are obviously a new thing for you where I use them every day and discussion lists are something I am not that familiar with

[Mod - update changed "Forum" to "Bulletin Board" to clear up some of the confusion now we have renamed things]

[kvivian]

Ron,

Excellent answers and I thank you for taking the time to clarify the details.

Actually, I am not new to Bulletin Boards...I have used and moderated them myself for about 20 years!   Each one is structured somewhat differently, however, and we are coming out of one that was integrated (i.e., postings in the Bulletin Boards went out to the discussion group as part of the digest).  Also,  the assumptions people hold about them can be quite different, so I wanted to clarify to be sure I'm doing the right thing to stay in touch with the group...whether by email or by threaded discussion Bulletin Boards!

I believe I understand now, and I'll leave it to others to raise any other questions they may have.  Thanks again.

Kaye

[Mod - Update changed "Forum" to "Bulletin Board" to ckear up some of the confusion nor that we have renamed things]

[RonRogers]

No problem that's what I am here for.

[garpet]

Thanks to all for the information, or should that read for the knowledge management 

Now all I have to do is to find a topic that I want to contribute to or take the risk of starting one AND having to moderate one <sigh>

[smarshall]

Hi guys,

I've read all of Ron's helpful hints (thanks Ron), but I still don't understand the following:  I  registered according to the instructions given at the start of this new system and stated that I wanted daily notifications (I registered for both the Bulletin Board and the Discussion List becuase I didn't know which one I would need, and I'm still not convinced that we need both).  However, despite following the instructions given and receiving acknowledgements of my registrations, I still haven't received one daily notification from the Discussion List ( and I'm unlikely to check the daily Bulletin Board as I simply don't have time for this).  Consequently, I'm fairly sure that I have missed out on the Discussion List postings and proably some very useful dialogue.

Surely the greatest benefit derivable from implementing a new system is to achieve simplicity, which then encourages members' input (and knowledge sharing).  I'm not sure this is the case now, as I simply don't get the posts and can't therefore make an informed judgment about it.  Given that we are supposed to be the champions of increasing knowledge sharing, can't we do better than this.

As to having a separate 'Bulletin Board' for specific discussions, that's all very nice if one knows what is on it and can then choose whether to participate or not.  I think that a daily email notification of the headings of each Bulletin Board contribution (so people can skim them and then check out those that interest them - similar to the so-far absent Discussion Lists one), that also gives the contributors' names (so people can decide whether they want to read that person's input - we all know why) would be a more useful way of encouraging knowledge sharing than relying on people to go find things if and when they have the time.

Anyway, can someone please solve the conundrum of why my daily Discussion Lists summary email hasn't been coming?

Cheers
Sylvia

[Mod - Update changed "Forum" to "Bulletin Board" to clear up some of the confusion now that we have renamed things]

[RonRogers]

Now all I have to do is to find a topic that I want to contribute to or take the risk of starting one AND having to moderate one <sigh>

Feel free to start a topic anytime

As for moderation well the moderation will be faily light and I or Mark will only step in if things get out of hand or Really off track or if we get called in.

[RonRogers]

Anyway, can someone please solve the conundrum of why my daily Discussion Lists summary email hasn't been coming?

Sylvia, looking into that for you now (Update: registration MIA? now fixed and email sent)

As for the rest of your Post
The Discussion List is the primary source for discussions and will continue to be so, this Bulletin Board was setup for those who want to have a discussion (which may get a little heated at times due to the passions and personalities involved) that may be of general interest to those in KM, but not a topic that everyone wants to be involved with.

If a couple of people engauge in a back and forth discussion via the Discussion list arguing their own points of view they may be asked to take things "OFF LINE" rather than flooding all the members with email that they will just have to filter through and delete to get to other messages from other members. In that case they are more than welcome to continue that discussion here and people can follow the flow and be involved should they choose to, even by subscribing to the topic using the 'Notify' button at the top of the topic.

We will also use this Bulletin Board for announcements (easier to find rather than trolling though emails) but if they are important then they will also be sent out via the Discussion list.

You also get to ask questions or get help like you just did, and the answers like those I posted to questions earlier are there for others to come along and read later rather than having to ask them over again. Of course if you need more details then ask away, I'll answer all I can.

[Mod - Update changed "Forum" to "Bulletin Board" to clear up some of the confusion now that we have renamed things]